Blue Blockers, Eye Health & Sungazing with Dayne Barkley (EP#114)

Mason: (00:01)

Hey, bro. Welcome.

Dayne Barkley: (00:02)

Hey, thanks for having me on.

Mason: (00:04)

Absolute pleasure. Rocking the beanie. Super autumn-y down there.

Dayne Barkley: (00:08)

Yeah. Beanie and a hot water bottle, actually. I've got a hot water bottle on my tummy. That's my go-to for winter months up here.

Mason: (00:15)

I feel like that's what I want to call it. When I go into [inaudible 00:00:20] mode and I'm like, "I've got a hot water bottle on my middle Jiao," but really what I want to say is that it's on my tummy.

Dayne Barkley: (00:25)

On my tummy, yeah. There's something warm and cosy about that too.

Mason: (00:28)

That's very responsible of your metabolic chi.

Dayne Barkley: (00:32)

It is.

Mason: (00:32)

Very proud of you. Hear a little copy going on there. What's happening?

Dayne Barkley: (00:39)

Yeah, I love it, yeah. This is my go-to great little podcast SuperFeast there. I have been drawn to Lion's Mane and Deer Antler of late. Maybe it's the season of my life as well. But I've been really loving that flavour with the coffee. We have a decaf. I don't drink much or have many stimulants.

Mason: (00:58)

Did you just recently get onto Deer Antler?

Dayne Barkley: (01:01)

I did, actually. It's been in my radar for actually since Truth brought it into the picture and then multiple people like Stefan is brought into my space and I'm like, "I've known how beneficial it is," and it wasn't until I felt called until recently, I was like, "I think it's time to turn Deer Antler." And I'm just craving the taste a lot, which is really cool.

Mason: (01:19)

How old are you, if you don't mind me asking?

Dayne Barkley: (01:21)

I'm 31.

Mason: (01:23)

It's after 30, we're talking about Truth Calkins back in the day when the Longevity crew coming out of LA, when we were really diving into the extremes right of herbalism and supplementation. Truth Calkins was one of the guys on the stage and doing that far out really... I don't know extreme is the right word, but he took a lot of stuff and did a lot of stuff.

Dayne Barkley: (01:45)

Still does.

Mason: (01:45)

Still does, right. He's singing the praises of Deer Antler. What Stefan's Instagram? Give him a shout out.

Dayne Barkley: (01:53)

@stefanfilippohealth. He's great.

Mason: (01:57)

How do you spell his last name?

Dayne Barkley: (01:58)

That's a good question, actually. Italian, I should know that. I think it's F-I-L-I-P-P-O.

Mason: (02:05)

I'll get it. I'll get it soon.

Dayne Barkley: (02:06)

He's been great.

Mason: (02:09)

I'll put a shout out if you need a little bit of a practitioner on your side.

Dayne Barkley: (02:13)

Yeah, he's great. He's really in the same space as ours, headspace, I guess, as we are, which is good.

Mason: (02:19)

Yeah, which is good. I need to give that shout out to people more and more, people need practitioners who are holistically been... we always had Dan Sippel on the podcast, but he has to be in capacity with clients now, so I need to expand that registry. I'm going to check out Stefan if we need that. It's like always you hear about Deer Antler or there's something and your mind's like, "I need it," and then you're like, "But I'm also 25 and I don't need it," and you might try it instinctively, right? You know that it's like, "I probably have enough Jing and vigour right now." I only brought it into the range of people on a Western diet for ages and had no libido and clients couldn't do it and ex-vegans, I think I've talked about on the podcast. Just bringing them back from the brink. But yeah, it doesn't have to be long, you'll hit a point where you'd be like, "I don't need any more of that."

Dayne Barkley: (03:12)

I'm feeling I'm tapering out now, actually. Yeah. I felt it, actually, yeah. I don't consciously think about it. It's more so I'm just not drawn to having it daily. I had it daily for a period and now it's just more there and I'm tapping to it slowly, but I feel that's pulled back now. It gave me a huge amount of charge, not what I was explained from what I've heard, it wasn't that crazy... I had a little bit of aggression came out and anger. It may have been suppressed, but it was more discharged towards business and life and taking responsibility in certain areas that I may not have been taken responsibility for. Mine wasn't so much of I need to work out and maybe as some people might believe an idea and, take it, and you can pre-work out and get... I didn't feel that. Mine was just more driven for and very focused towards what I can to build the business and my life as well. Interesting.

Mason: (04:06)

Just talking to you, it looks like you use that energy. We'll talk about Barkley Eyewear we're both wearing right now, if you're on the video version. The blue blocking glasses space, that probably, as you know, I'm going to suspect a couple of things here. First of all, it's been a decade I think where it's been really in the consciousness of the health scene and now it's way beyond that.

Dayne Barkley: (04:31)

Exactly.

Mason: (04:31)

It's been cool. I've seen you pop up over the last little while without knowing it was you. I think you've just been [crosstalk 00:04:38] someone through Stefan on Instagram. But I imagine I've bought a few and the quality has been quite crap and I'm wearing yours and I'm like, "Ah, it feels real good." It feels nice when you get a real deal and not just a cheapy thing. I want to ask about how that Deer Antler energy has helped you take that to the next level, but I know just talking to you before the podcast and on your podcast, using that energy to shake, any external identity, health, same click energy. I don't know, I'm just curious, throwing out, but you don't have to talk much too because I want to get cheap losses.

Mason: (05:18)

I find that a lot, you use that Jing and that stag energy, and you can shake off that identification, which I feel might be hard with, sometimes, especially when you have a product that it's going to make sense to position yourself as like, I'm going to use the information as a biohacker in order to open up to the biohacking community, but you've gone beyond that. I don't know, I just got that connection there with you taking Deer Antler. I think it's a bold move and a good move for your business. But yeah, let's jump into that. But I wanted to hear about the start of this as well.

Dayne Barkley: (05:53)

Definitely. Yeah, it's a really good point, actually, to mention that, is that the Deer Antler, definitely from that perspective of, I guess, it's given me almost more courage as well to be taking the leaps, so to speak. Actually, funny enough, we have stags that come up and down our road here. Even attracting that kind of energy as well, which is awesome. I love deer as well. That's why I'm, again, really big advocate for yours because it's the humane aspect of it, it's what we spoke about briefly in our podcasts, that's people might go, "Oh no, you're ripping off deer antlers." There's a lot more involved than that and you would definitely understand that.

Dayne Barkley: (06:28)

But I guess for me, it's this whole journey as well and even 'til recently as well, even with the glasses, to be honest, it's like I sometimes just get in spaces of this is not enough. People sometimes identify themselves as being I know, actually, I'm very aware of what else is out there in terms of people that are promoting blue blockers and the identity that they've created for themselves, whether they call themselves the light something and they're like, "It's all about light and sun." For me, it's like, that's just a very small proponent of life. I want people to understand the foundations, integrate it, and then move on.

Dayne Barkley: (07:04)

There's a lot more to life as well than just focusing on grounding and sunning every day or getting the right blue blockers on. I feel it's a useful tool to integrate. It's very easy to integrate, but then once you do that, then move on and do things that you're passionate about, find your purpose, take your herbs, sleep well, drink well, eat well. There's so many other factors, even emotional health, to be honest.

Dayne Barkley: (07:26)

For me, it's like, I had to sort of strip down where I came from. I was very much big in the primal space and I'd really want to attach onto an identity when I was in my mid-20s, early to mid-20s, so I went into that primal. I was like a primal person. Then I called myself a biohacking for a while because I was really big on Dave Asprey. And then I found neurohacking and started calling myself a neurohacker. It's funny because I remember looking at my bio on Instagram and my bio on Instagram would change as I evolved. I'd be a biohacker, then I changed it. I didn't like that term, neurohacker is what I am. And then I went to a mitochondriac, whatever that is, which was Dr. Jack Kruse was all about. So mitochondria and I was just in this space.

Dayne Barkley: (08:11)

Looking back, there's very much development of what I was. I'm so grateful that I've got to a point where I don't need to identify with anything. No religion, no food, no dogma, nothing. Just what feels right to me, and what resonates with me, and what I've learnt over the years, and who I am, and what I think I've been called to doing this earth's time and life. All those spaces have dropped down and I've just taken on the holistic health space because I feel that's the most common term to encompass everything that I believe in, which is such a multifaceted approach to health as well.

Dayne Barkley: (08:44)

I don't like to be specifically saying, "Hey, you need to do this and then you're set," because it is understanding my journey and my journey with Indi as well, that's my partner, is that it's so intense. Even our relationship, the amount of energy that goes into learning me moving into a marriage in a year's time with Indi, I have to develop or become into this, almost these rites of passage into this king that can provide and protect for our family. Deer Antler is an incredible deep reservoir building for that and that's probably why I've been drawn to that in this time because it's connecting the dots. It makes a lot of sense why I want to build, and provide, and protect.

Dayne Barkley: (09:22)

And so that is the energy I'm moving towards and that moves towards the glasses. That has actually helped significantly myself with the glasses because I've had a lot of trouble with myself with either fear of rejection or even just putting myself out there. That masculine energy of being like here's my glasses and get them to people and say, "Hey," and be proud of them and be like, "There's a lot of energy I've put into this. I put in a ridiculous amount of energy to get this going." That Deer Antler energy and as well as other herbs as well that's built over time has allowed me to step more into the more masculine side of things. That's allowed me to sort of push a bit more than I would be on the feminine side of receiving and being like, I'll build the glasses, and you come to me, and you find me. That's been a really fascinating approach over the last six to 12 months.

Mason: (10:15)

Good props to you. Of course, I think everyone listening knows that we both know that herbs are a nice supporter, but props to you having the balls to go through that process. Well, I think of something I like about your brand and I've always liked about your brand and I relate a lot to your journey. Have you ever read the marketing book? Is it hard? This is a good example to make distinction, because I've brought it up before for people, of what it takes to actually go down your own path and the difference between a foe going down your own path and then a real mysterious one that's really dynamic, and that's a little bit more slow-growing, and doesn't lend itself as much to the real egoic hustle of the entrepreneurial scene. It's called Blue Ocean, Red Ocean. It's a marketing... you know that book?

Dayne Barkley: (11:10)

Yeah.

Mason: (11:11)

That is one... I know there's a lot of people who listen to this podcast who either are fans of little brands who like to understand them a little bit more, little brands like ours, and then people who will start their own company. The red ocean is that market share that you need to go. It's safe and you are fighting over the same market share. What you're talking about there, just a little slight example of being identified in primal and biohacking, although it's not a bad thing, staying in that space, what I can sense, that you identify is going to give you that feeling of an out of alignment competitiveness where you are fighting for scraps in the same world.

Mason: (11:59)

These people, you still offer it to them and market to them, but at that point, you're not only preaching what you mean. You're not realising, but the whole point of going through the process of being integrated into the biohacking and primal community is then you leave and then you go and find other people that resonate with the principles. That's the blue ocean. You go and you stop comparing and you start figuring out what your very unique messaging is and make it accessible to people who aren't the exact people that you originally identified with. I think that's cool. It's a subtle thing. It's a real subtle feeling. It's hard to describe. So I just wanted to point out that difference for people listening because this is a good case study of that. By all means, if you want to share a little bit on that. And then I want to hear about the story, were you a bit forlorn about the quality of blue blockers out there or were you excited by the quality that was out there and think, "I'd to get into this space"? What was your little in there?

Dayne Barkley: (13:04)

I guess, with that, for me, it was a combination. I guess it's understanding myself more now. I'm 31. It's understanding that okay, from my childhood to now, I've always been someone to want to be different, and I've always wanted to stand out and not stand in and want to be part of the crowd. Someone to always be unique. That was since as far as I can remember how I was. With the blue blockers, something didn't meet my requirements, so there wasn't a modern stylish pair of frames that I would feel comfortable wearing outside the house because I'm very aesthetically-minded. That's how to operate. It's all meshed in aesthetics and visuals. I'm like there weren't any out there that I felt comfortable wearing and let alone ones that I understood the biophysics enough of health, of lighting, thanks to Jack Kruse's work.

Dayne Barkley: (13:59)

Once I grasped that knowledge, I realised that there's importance of having the tinted lenses for night, which are the orange and red ones, but also just having the clear ones or a day clip on for the day. For me, it was not having multiple pairs of glasses as well as having a pair that looked good. It was that combination that I'm like, "Hey, there's nothing out there." Someone should scratch my own back and get that out. I'm one of the biggest consumer in products. I wear my glasses every day and especially at nighttime, particularly the most at nighttime.

Dayne Barkley: (14:30)

For me, that was a point, I'm like, "There's nothing out there," and initially, that felt great to be like, "Hey, let's create this." If I knew what was going to come from the last two, three years of creating these, I may have had a second guess putting them towards that. The amount of effort and energy and identity to have to... I have to pull back so much of my ego in so many spaces when I wanted to be like, "I'll just make the glasses, and I'm blocking U.S., and they'll be good. These people will love them." I'll build them and I will come and this whole mentality, I had 'til the last two or three years of letting go of a lot of that, and humble myself, and just be in really difficult financial situations.

Dayne Barkley: (15:07)

I understand right now it's absolutely perfect, my development as well. I wouldn't change that because it's allowed me to become the way I am right now and I've got a strong foundation of who I am and the glasses. For me, it was that combination and the actual driver behind all of that because that was what I saw out in the world, was actually my grandmother, she passed away in 2017. She was blind for my entire life. For the last, I think, 30 odd years, she was blind. I saw how difficult lack or loss of eyesight actually played on herself and I then connected the dots one morning, actually, a few years back.

Dayne Barkley: (15:48)

I was actually outside grounding and sun gazing. I was doing that whole practise and I think it was in that space of grounding every day and having my smoothies. I was on that different journey and I connected the dots. I think it hit me, I'm like, "I wanted to create a pair of glasses that my family, for starters, would feel comfortable wearing, and then my friends, and then onwards, so that I could protect their eyesight so they don't have the damage that's going to happen from exposure to consistent, unofficial lighting and head down the road of macular degeneration or all the other sort of eyesight conditions."

Dayne Barkley: (16:22)

Even though my nan's condition was genetic and it's hereditary, that wasn't much of a factor, it was more lack of eyesight. I almost could see what was coming because screens are prevalent now everywhere and artificial lighting is, for now, it's short-term, so people just get the headaches or the eyestrain, but the long-term, understanding a bit more about their biophysics and the science behind that, got me saying, "Wow, this can really be prevented very easily." It just needs to be some things integrated into people's lives and the knowledge to be shared a bit more. That was the driver behind it and also I didn't see anything else like that out there for the glasses.

Mason: (17:01)

You've made it clear that you haven't just taken... What happens with a lot of business in these health brands is you take a scalpel to a very holistic conversation and take, as you were saying before, the grounding and light-based conversation out, and you take that out, and you create a whole brand in a world. That rather than going down the arduous path of making people aware of the holistic sphere in which this comes from, which allows you to manage expectations better, but makes it a little bit harder to market in a really fast, and quick, and dirty way.

Mason: (17:36)

There's a couple of directions of the things that I want you to land in though, just see if you can open up and really talk about one, the connection... Let's start with say the holistic space in which we are going to maintain eye health and allow ourselves to maintain healthy exposure to light. The grounding, either sun gazing or what that's evolved into for you in terms of morning sun. I want to hear about you understanding the biomechanics and the chemical reactions, and explain the importance of those. In terms of a rhythm of the body, what are you trying to protect or nourish or remain cultivated through having the glasses being present in people's Western lives?

Dayne Barkley: (18:23)

Yeah, good questions. Really good questions. The first one, it would be I guess, ultimately, with the glasses is that I think it's a really useful tool. Once integrated, it can be forgotten in a sense and then I feel it's not I have to be you have to keep topping up or in certain other areas that's important. But with these, I feel like if people understood... it's almost if you had it for two or three weeks consistently, you realise the benefits and you wouldn't want to take them off. Very probably cult-like maybe. It's like, you got to wear your glasses.

Dayne Barkley: (18:54)

But unless you had an environment that is, ideally, will have allowed people to move towards more of a natural lighting environment. Ourselves out here in the mountains, we have candles, we use that often, and then we also have our fireplace. That creates mood as well, but allows our body to... for people that might not understand about the actual benefits is that we've evolved under the starlight and moonlight, sunlight, all this lighting. So the lighting that comes from our overhead lights from our screens is so alien, so foreign to our beings is that we're exposed to that sunset. Well, pretty much, essentially, allowing cortisol to stay high and melatonin to be suppressed.

Dayne Barkley: (19:35)

For most people, understanding melatonin is that sleepy hormone, so a great way to experience that firsthand is to have all your overhead lightings off and have a screen-free night. That's actually a practise that Indi I have really coined and jumped on and wanted to share with people more consistently is a screen-free night. It might not be practical for everyone for every single night, but if you integrate one or two a week, you get to really experience the benefits for free as well. So you don't need a pair of glasses, you just don't have screens after sunset and you had your lighting will either be candlelight or if you have a fireplace, great. But, naturally, when you're in that space, if you're with a partner, you can connect more as well on a deeper level, and you will feel the melatonin just roaring through your body and you'll be so tired, it will be impossible to stay awake.

Dayne Barkley: (20:23)

Most people, I believe, that have insomnia, it's just because they're usually exposed or stimulated by something. If you're sitting in a room with some candle light and you're talking or reading the book, I find it still to this day incredibly hard to stay awake. Eyes get so heavy and that's the sign of melatonin just rushing out in the body. That's a practise that we want to get people to understand and the benefits of that as well because you don't have to buy a pair of glasses, you don't have to do anything. You can just try this right now and have the benefits show for itself.

Dayne Barkley: (20:52)

But then we also understand that's impractical for every night as well. I'm like, that's just not an option for people to say, "Hey, just go screen-free." Some people may recommend that, but that's why the glasses, I feel like, is a tool that can be integrated to complement that as well into that space. That ties in as well to the grounding and the sun gazing. I was really deep in that space a couple of years ago and I still do recommend that if you can, but our environment has changed right now. We're in the mountains and so getting a morning sun gazing session isn't possible for us right now. When we can, we go to ground in our front or back garden and in winter, which we're heading towards, it's very difficult as well. It's very wet, and damp, and dark as well. For me, I'm learning to integrate or even learning to explore new areas that aren't just close to the equator.

Dayne Barkley: (21:44)

Being up in Byron there, you might have more options to be able to be grounded or whoever these people listening, well, listening to this episode, they can actually understand if you have the ability to ground in the morning and get some morning sunlight into the eyes, you don't have to look directly out to the sun, you can look just below it, but just getting that exposure to that as well, it allows the body... it's anchoring the day of being like, hey, it's this time of the day and you're awake now. And then when you block the light off the sunset, it's almost those two together as perfect.

Dayne Barkley: (22:13)

For us, we're trying to explore light boxes now, understanding having the light cue in the morning, just a little hit of maybe 10 minutes or 20 minutes of a light box, and learning, and trying to experiment with those different frequencies of light and what works for us can allow us to be a... it suppresses the melatonin in the morning and increases the dopamine, the serotonin, and the cortisol so you can actually take your day and actually go with it, whereas at nighttime, it's the opposite way around. People can see as almost it's an anchoring for morning and night and that's what I was wanting to get people to understand about if you can ground, it's awesome. There's so many benefits in grounding [inaudible 00:22:53].

Dayne Barkley: (22:55)

For me, I remember the feeling is a very spiritual practise as well. I remember I was going through a difficult period in my life a few years ago with a lot of losses in the family and so that was a space for me to ground in sun gaze and have a lot of insight and that gave me an insight towards the glasses as well. But I also believe it isn't just once you're in there, you have to ground and sungaze for the rest of your life. I feel there's a season and there's a phase for that. For me, that was a big season. If you feel drawn to that, great, if not, then find another way you can get some lighting into your eyes or into your body, your skin in the morning.

Dayne Barkley: (23:30)

That was the anchoring for the start of the day, which I experienced for a couple of years. And then now, at nighttime, for the last few years now, is that whole sort of getting dark and getting sort of introspective. Even if you are closer to the tropical equator and in that lateral environment, still be able to have that ability to just sort of darken your house to slowly go off to a nice deep slumber, a nice sleep as well. That element for people, I feel that alone can have just profound impacts on people's health, and life, and emotional health as well. I find I have some pretty disrupted nights of sleep, next day my emotional stability and resilience is just terrible. It's because of someone's baseline is quite high now these days with the amount of sleep that I really focus on. If I have a bad night's sleep, I make sure the following night I did the best I can to do that, but there's things that I don't control.

Mason: (24:23)

Question about the light box. Is that the specific type of light that you're using in the morning or are you happy with a conventional light in the house?

Dayne Barkley: (24:35)

It's an actual device itself. There's a difference there between two. Flickering light as well. A lot of light boxes, not a lot of them, but overhead lights or actually light itself can have a flicker rate, which scrambles the brain to be able to... people are not familiar with that. The great way to test that is get up your iPhone, hold on slow motion camera, and hold it up to the light. You actually see the flicker in there as well. That's a great way for people to test straight away for free and being if they have flicker in their light.

Dayne Barkley: (25:03)

Most fluorescents have a lot of flicker, understandably. Not only is it bad on the spectrum of lighting in terms of an alien artificial spectrum, it's actually got the flicker right in there as well, which it causes the eye... it's very difficult for the eye to interpret the messages from the light, so it causes more sort of headaches, fatigue because your brain's working overdrive. Our light box is flicker-free. You hold a camera up to it, it's completely light, and it has different frequencies of lights as well. It goes in Kelvin, which is how you measure light frequency. I've got a light here now, it's not a light box, but it's a ring light. We're still experimenting with that element to get a little-

Mason: (25:43)

Do you sell them?

Dayne Barkley: (25:45)

No, we don't, no. I'm actually still trying to find... the one I think I got was by Verilux, V-E-R-I-L-U-X. There's a few brands out there and we're still experimenting to see what we like most. We want to get into see either the vitamin D sometimes as well and see what I guess their benefits are.

Mason: (26:08)

Some lamps, because for me, that example comes in with my mum. She's disabled, can't always get out and get that morning, AM light if the sun's not coming in the right way or if it's just a little bit difficult to get her out in the morning. I experimented with the vitamin D lights. A bit intense, not practical for her. But what you're talking about there is getting a bit of a flicker-free exposure in the morning, hitting your eyes, hitting your skin, getting you into a rhythm of yang. I just want to get to bring up, I really appreciate your point of view there because what we're talking about is, we've already stated it, not coming from valid, nonetheless, you're not coming from a biohacker.

Mason: (26:51)

We're going to optimise, which is good in a very Western mindset of going let's hit homeostasis. You are talking about a natural rhythm. It's whether you're talking ancient Vedic or Taoist. We're just talking about flowing with the rhythm of nature and that's effectively getting into a yang state when you get in the morning. That's why pairing up, it's a Chop Wood Carry Water lifestyle practise to go and get light hitting your eyes, either just being outside. I'm not sun gazing at the moment because I'm spending too much inside. I'm like, "You know what, I'm not going to do that to my eyes." But I gaze, as you said, in that direction. Just letting that eye or maybe just eyes closed, hitting my eyelids. It's one of those saviour practises and rhythms for me.

Mason: (27:41)

And then you're talking about flowing into and on that as well, getting your body moving and kickstarting with that movement in the morning. Not aggressive, it doesn't have to be aggressive, but just making sure your body enters into a yang state. And then there's all those hormones that are correlating with them. And then you're just talking about getting into a rhythm where you are descending with the energy back down to the earth and entering into a yin state at night. It's a nice way to approach it, that doesn't come with that hectic optimization and constant pressure, which I do like as an in, but then it takes some non-attachment to and acceptance that you're going to be doing this for the rest of your lives. It's a really nice use of a technology helping you get back to a natural rhythm. I really appreciate that approach that you have there.

Mason: (28:35)

I had another point, hopefully it'll come back to me, but you can keep on kicking, man.

Dayne Barkley: (28:40)

It's awesome. Just to that point you said too, I definitely have had my journey on the way that was I was gadgety. If anything, I would measure my body fats, and engine muscles, and I'd measure so many things. I still measure my sleep with the aura and just more of a guidance.

Mason: (28:59)

We're giving each other the finger, guys, the aura [crosstalk 00:29:02].

Dayne Barkley: (29:03)

That's it. That's the measure. That's really the last tool I have that's in that biohacking space and also, the glasses that would be considered in that space, I guess, because it's just not so much. I don't really measure anything more now. I think I know who I am, I know what works for me. Me it's like, yeah, it's that rhythm. It's the rhythm of life. It's the rhythm of seasons. It's the rhythm of light and dark cycles. If people get back to that, I think the health benefits of that are beyond what we can possibly comprehend. It's not like, "Oh, you increase your testosterone by 2% or this."

Dayne Barkley: (29:35)

Honestly, I've lost any sort of care for those little metrics and trying to tweak those metrics and functional medicine can get really obsessed with that. Whereas for me, we're not just these physical beings that are just trying to measure out percentages and measure my body fat and make sure I'm staying lean. I'm like, "I'm just the leanest and strongest I've ever been and that's because I've been chopping wood, and that's because I've been going to bed well, and sleeping well, and eating well, and drinking well." It's just not because I'm measuring it so intensely. I don't measure what I eat or all that stuff. It's just the life now is a very flowy state and it's in between masculine and feminine, yin and yang. That energy is what I'm sort of dancing around with.

Dayne Barkley: (30:17)

It's taken me a while to get there, understandably. Knowing my journey, I can't understand anyone just to go straight into that kind of approach because I feel it takes a lot of wisdom, and time, and experience to flow into that. I don't know what else I was going to say. I think I lost my train of thought there.

Mason: (30:34)

I could just feel that we were both flying off into a real moment. [crosstalk 00:30:38] round down a little bit now. I'm going to have a little glass of water, coming back down to earth.

Dayne Barkley: (30:46)

That's true.

Mason: (30:51)

I've struggled with the glasses. Also, you mentioned about you always like to be different and on the cutting edge. I'm like that as well once. I was using the glasses for a while there in my mid-20 and then at some point, when everyone started using them, my scallywag was just like, "All right, I'm out." Another thing you brought up, melatonin, no lights on at night. A lot of people, there will be insomnia, whether it's your lack of capacity to stay asleep or get to sleep or whatever it is.

Mason: (31:29)

I think what the lights at night do as well, because sometimes they are the causative or I don't even know if that's a word, but I'm pretty sure they are. I didn't get a good night's sleep last night, so I'm just going to say yep, that's a good word. That it is real. Whether it's a causative factor, sometimes it's also revealing the symptom or the underlying, whether it's a hormonal dysfunction or if you go into more of a Taoist perspective, an underlying factor, whether it's a slight yin deficiency and a lacking of capacity to either cultivate yin at that point a lot of the time, staying asleep is going to be difficult or whether it's excessive fire activity in your body, which is then leading to the spirit not being able to ground, therefore the mind running off and anxiety is going forward, whatever it is. There's also anxiety that can come from a spleen deficiency and you're constantly ruminating on a thought, therefore can't digest life, therefore you're sitting there, whatever it is.

Mason: (32:35)

What all that means is your chi is less adaptive for the capacity to actually transform between yin and yang, chi kwa, which we've talked about on the podcast, or hormonal adaptability. For me, it's been a funny thing that I've been able to have screens at night and at times, when life just got too busy and too hectic with kids and all that, I've literally just had to go put it aside and go, "I can't handle it right now," but I've had an adaptability within my hormonal system that it hasn't been a huge impact, which is a hard thing. This is a hard thing for everyone in the whole herbal conversation, this health practise conversation. It's like, yeah, but it's not really affecting me.

Mason: (33:21)

Even my old woman will tell me sometimes, "I've got a really great sleep." And I was like, "Oh, cool. Well, I had a screen just before bed and, obviously, that doesn't affect me." But that's because I'm quite adaptable and adaptive, but it doesn't take away from the fact that at some point, you get a little bit more mature and you realise it's taking energy in order to maintain that adaptability.

Mason: (33:43)

At times, when it's appropriate, even though you might not be getting super affected by this, at times, again, a gentle curiosity to just be like, "I wonder if it can get a little bit better, if I can get it a little bit more in sync," at appropriate times. There's times when you want to be able to fit this in because [crosstalk 00:33:57]. But nonetheless, an invitation to go, just see what happens if you do go, "All right, I'm going to shop in this practise a little bit more," and go descend with the yin and really rise with the yang and see what kind of organic rollercoaster that sends me on through the day.

Mason: (34:13)

We'll notice, a lot of the time, those extra few percent, in a Western sense, or a little bit more ease and rhythm, that's where those feelings in the chi sense, you feel like you're on your destiny a little bit more because life flows because you're literally in a flow with nature around you. It's worth exploring, guys, if you are in that position where you're not. Even if it's not going to make the biggest impact, it's the subtlety. It's the herbs. You don't want them having a huge feeling impact because it shows that you've been deficient or lacking a capacity to transform.

Mason: (34:45)

But where the magic comes in is where the subtlety of them fine-tuning your capacity to transform chi in sync with the world around you is awesome. I think that is what I've been getting about the glasses and that subtle change in attitude. It just came at a really good time when you sent me your ones because I feel a real nice, non-judgement -based approach. I'm doing this because I want to be the right approach. I think that I've opened up because you've gone and had that journey yourself in that space and brought that energy to your brand. I'm really happy getting back on board and being aligned with a brand like yours because I vibe it.

Dayne Barkley: (35:35)

I appreciate that. It means a lot. I really appreciate that the way you understand that and feel that as well and, I guess, even our interactions, knowing that I'm not in it just to make some money because I know in this space, the eyewear industry is multi-trillion dollars and it can be just optimised, make the glasses, big profit margins. Again, same as the adaptogens and mushrooms space, understanding the founders and the people behind it and their journey for me is so important. Understanding, hearing about yourself as well and all the adaptogens and mushrooms, it just adds a level of trust and this ability of this is a good brand. I trust who's the founder behind it. Your company, and your ethos, and all that as well.

Dayne Barkley: (36:18)

And that's what I wanted to get out with people as well. I'm tiny and I'm probably one of the smallest blue blockers in the world, but it doesn't mean that because they're so small that they're not a shitty product. I put in everything, my time, money, energy, and soul into this to get this going and to have such a unique product that can be integrated. My main purpose was to integrate this from the biohacking space into the mainstream. I felt the mainstream wouldn't feel comfortable wearing most of these orange goggles or ones that I wore for a few years since Uvex glasses or even anything else. But one that has the ability to interchange and actually still have the impact, and effectiveness on there, and to have the quality materials. I don't want to put out plastic pairs of glasses. These are cellulose acetate. I'm going to be moving towards, eventually, biodegradable acetate and so that would be even better again. That's my next process in the company.

Dayne Barkley: (37:15)

Indi and I are huge on sustainability, so don't add more waste into the world, create what's already there, and having biodegradable, and have everything recyclable. I hand removed all the plastic that was in the glasses and so everything in it is either cardboard or even the packaging is compostable. All these things I'm really conscious of. I'm not doing it from a place of greenwashing and being like, "We do this because we support 1% of the planet." It's like, this is what I can do in my very small company that can have an impact and I'll keep growing and evolving that along the way. But right now, this is the baseline product, which, I believe, I still haven't seen anything else out there like this that have the ability for that and so I'm still very confident and proud to be able to get this out to people, and actually get the impact, and have the feedback come back about how it's actually helping people. That really means a lot.

Dayne Barkley: (38:11)

But also I don't rely on that too because that sometimes can boost the ego and being like this is great. For me it's great that it impacts, but it's also, for me, I didn't believe that it was... I was just a vessel and I was open enough to receive the idea. People might see this as woo woo about in the space that I was just open, I wanted to make this product, and I didn't know how to hit it. So the idea came to me and I was like, "Oh great." I just received that idea and I just put it on the ground and took it to the surface, so to speak, and created the product, and so now it's out there in a capacity and still so very small scale. But it's having the impact.

Dayne Barkley: (38:49)

Yeah, it's really nice now to be in that grounded state and getting out there, and be more masculine, and showing people, and being proud of it. I'm not scared. I was very scared of being an aggressive marketer because I've seen other blue blockers just go and aggressively market their product and they've done very well for themselves now and earning millions. But I'm just this little guy just chugging along. The funny thing is, what I think about daily is that the glasses are a direct reflection of my growth and evolution.

Dayne Barkley: (39:16)

So as I grow and evolve, so as the glasses do. When they weren't visible, because I've had them on the market for over 12 months now, when people weren't really aware of them is because I wasn't really aware of myself enough to be able to get them out there and be the confidence and have that energy, that yang energy going, that masculine energy. Now it's like I've got to this stage where I'm in this rites of passage towards my marriage, which has allowed me to get these out to the world and be, I guess, in the space of being confident and being like, "No, this is it. This is going to have the impact. I'm going to do it in place of not egoness as well and be like, this is the product."

Mason: (39:51)

Man, so good. It's hard to be sustainable to that extent when you start out. Props to you for doing that. It sounds like I've been thinking about this a lot lately, when you start out a business, the good thing about starting at a grassroots business is you have strong principles and values. The idea is to not allow them to continue to inform your growth. But I think, you probably relate, where you get stuck is when the assumptions that you have and almost the vision, to an extent, of what it's going look and the particular judgments you have at that particular time of your consciousness and growth stage, starting a business, that can inform for years, and years, and years, and years what you think is selling out, what you think is ethical and unethical.

Mason: (40:42)

There's one thing not budging on principles and values, that's not what I'm talking about here. That's absolutely paramount. But it's these assumptions of what the outcome looks like. For ages, I thought if I did a particular thing, it would be a sellout because that's how I would have judged it back when I started out the company and it was a really disrespectful way to relate to my evolving self because I didn't have skills and insights of the world that I was entering into when I've started out. Why would I let that novice... the novice, yes, can inform the values, but why would I let that novice tell me what a company is to look at and what it should and shouldn't be doing? It's a huge distinction when you go, "No, I really respect that right now." I have insights that I didn't have back then and I'm going to remain adaptive to... it's like plasticity.

Dayne Barkley: (41:34)

It is.

Mason: (41:35)

You need to be able to change and then, therefore, you need to allow your brain to change. A lot of people are just anchored to that past judgmental self because they're judgmental of the world and, therefore, they become their own worst critic and it stops them from actually moving into new and beautiful spaces. I'm glad you're on that trip because you've got a really great product and it deserves to be out there and you deserve to have a very successful company.

Mason: (42:03)

I was really impressed. I've gotten lots of blue blockers over the years. Well, I've seen probably four different brands. That's a lot, I think. No, more actually. I've been given and I've had the big yellow, orange construction site ones, eye-protective wear and then I've been given cutting edge red ones. I liked them. It stops getting in the side at night, but I'm like I'm not reading to my daughter at night wearing them. It's just too... I don't know. Some people love it. For me, it's too obnoxious.

Dayne Barkley: (42:32)

True.

Mason: (42:33)

Yours is sick. Really comes in a nice packaging, man, and you understand about the concept of simplifying. Can you run me through it just so I'm fully aware? It comes fitted. I've taken mine off. Oh, my freaking my eyes. My eyes are not supposed to get flickering blue light in it. That's [crosstalk 00:42:59] or not, but...

Dayne Barkley: (43:01)

That could be another point too, the obsessive side of things. The getting too obsessed that you can't see blue light ever again, like, oh no. You can integrate it, great. But let go of being such an obsessive tool that you have to have it, otherwise you go blind.

Mason: (43:14)

I've got them as they are, right? This lens that comes when you first get it out of the packaging, is this just clear? Is this just nothing's-going-on lens or is this-

Dayne Barkley: (43:31)

It's got blue blocking in that one, yeah.

Mason: (43:33)

That's a blue blocking.

Dayne Barkley: (43:34)

Yeah. The very base lens is what they call planar lens. Planar lens mean that it's not prescription nor is it a magnification. It's just a plain lens, but it has blue blocking technology in that. Essentially, all the blue blockers on the market that are clear lens will have the same technology as these ones here. You can tell by holding up towards the light and it would reflect a bluey green. When you're holding the glasses and looking towards a light, you actually see the blue and green reflection of it. It's only a very small percentage that it blocks.

Dayne Barkley: (44:05)

It's enough to get people getting used to wearing glasses, which is my intention behind that. That it's a great frame and it doesn't distort colour. People that need colour to work with, it's really good. It has some benefit, not as much as the clip-ons would, obviously, but there's a great base lens. But I don't think people should stop at that. That's what a lot of blue blocking companies out there that are just chugging it down there, the clean lens ones does everything. It doesn't. It's great for daytime and it's great for a very base intro level of glasses.

Mason: (44:36)

Dude, the frames are good. Another reason I stopped wearing them at night is because Tony would bag me out. I put these on. I went to the Crystal once and then I felt sexy. I was wearing one little college [inaudible 00:44:56] and I had these on. At one point, I had a scarf on because it was a windy cold autumn morning and I really did it for the times. I was going and doing a talk that night [inaudible 00:45:09] and she was like, "Dude, wear that. Wear the glasses," and I was like, "You know what, I can just feel..." It was just a new invitation to be... it's important. You don't want to feel a dweeb. Anyway, I survived that. Good. I figured as much that I've been wearing the bare minimum and I thought I'd wait for the podcast before I went into the other. Now, clipping it. What do I have to worry about? To actually get it on...

Dayne Barkley: (45:37)

The best way to get them on, what I recommend people do is when they have the frames already on the face and then you literally bend it. The clip-ons themselves are very flexible, so they have a lot of feel. You bend it over the top and then it clips to the sides.

Mason: (45:50)

That's super easy.

Dayne Barkley: (45:51)

Yeah. Some people can do it one-handed. There's certain ways of doing it, but they clip on and off super easy and they're very flexible. Indi is taking them for a ride, the glasses. She's throwing them everywhere. They haven't broken or split. They're very sturdy, that's what I'm trying to say.

Mason: (46:10)

All right, so we got yellow. We've got the basics. We don't have to clip anything on if you want to do what most basic blue blockers are doing and it's just going to do that. I'm going to move all my crew over to yours because we've got them from two years ago, just some basic clear blue blockers that everyone wears just to... you know what it's like. They're all working on screens and I want to talk a little bit more about eye health and maintaining eye health with the glasses and also just holistically because I assume you've got some [crosstalk 00:46:42] and I'm really wary of it for my staff at the moment because I don't want to see the inevitability. It's so easy to shrug off.

Dayne Barkley: (46:49)

Exactly.

Mason: (46:50)

It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, this is just something you're going to have to work in front of a computer. Some basic reminders from you about how to maintain eye health and not sacrifice yourself because it's basically sacrificing your liver from a TCM perspective and so that would be in congruent with our message. I've got the yellow one now and that already does feel much nicer. I've just got a little bit more of a band. It's not too hectic, but taking out [crosstalk 00:47:19] blue light.

Dayne Barkley: (47:22)

Actually, the yellow lens blocks it. People, to have an understanding, when it comes to blue blockers, it's great to have an understanding of the nanometer range. That's the most important aspect. The nanometer range says that the clip-on blocks are between three 80 nanometers and 450 nanometers and that is all the violet light. I've got a little bookmark that comes along that gives people an explanation of when to wear them or it blocks. But most people are familiar with blue blockers. Essentially, though they should be having ones that block violet light during the day, ideally. Nighttime, it should be blue and then some elements of green as well. It goes between violet to red in the spectrum of the nanometer range. I'm going to share more than information from Instagram soon about understanding those ranges and what should be blocked. That doesn't block any blue. Actually, blue comes from 450 onwards.

Mason: (48:14)

At 450, is that the dusk?

Dayne Barkley: (48:18)

Yeah, the dusk lens is what we found there. That one there we found is probably the best one to wear out and look great as well.

Mason: (48:25)

What do you mean wear out?

Dayne Barkley: (48:27)

If you're wearing it outside the house at night, it's probably the safest to wear. The Delta ones are pretty hectic, so we don't really recommend the Delta ones to be worn in your home if you're watching TV because then you have the control of that, but it doesn't have a lot of visibility in terms of if you are going to be driving or out the bat or out in public somewhere. That is a-

Mason: (48:47)

The dusk one. Because that's a huge thing for me when I'm coming home at night from [crosstalk 00:48:51]. I don't know what's going on with those lights, but somehow, they've gone to the absolute edge of what's legal of a light brightness without it being on high beams.

Dayne Barkley: (49:00)

Exactly. Exactly.

Mason: (49:01)

Great. There goes all my melatonin.

Dayne Barkley: (49:05)

Yeah, it does. It's so harsh for us now when we drive home at night. I've actually driven home a few times with my Delta lens on and I don't recommend that. It's probably illegal. That's the only time I'd actually wear them at home because then you can really block on all blue light. But in terms of the nanometer range, for people to understand, is that the 380 to 450 is the day clip and that's just the violet range. And then the next clip-on, which is the dusk one, blocks between 380 and 590 minutes, which has all the blue light. And so you're blocking all the blue from the dusk and then the Delta one is all the blue light, a hundred percent blue light, and then it blocks roundabout, I think, 70% or 80% of the green light as well.

Dayne Barkley: (49:50)

c

Dayne Barkley: (50:31)

But they're essentially clip-ons and they're powder-coated black matte as well. I've designed them so they look cool on all the frames. They're the same black coating finish around the edges as well. Indi loves wearing day clips on because of the black powder coating edging around that. It shapes the frame as well. Again, the funny thing is I have no idea about glasses. That's the funny thing. I'm not some person that's like, "I know my glasses." I don't. I just have a thing for aesthetics and I took years to explore what everyone else is doing, so I just copied really good. I copied elements that I really liked and just integrate it into my own development.

Dayne Barkley: (51:10)

All these things, clip-ons aren't new, but clip-ons with blue blocking technology is. There's clip-ons for sort of polarised lenses, and people might be familiar with that aspect of things, and I had to decide whether I want an actual clip-ons or magnetic clip-ons. Actually, there's two options. It would be an actual clip or the ones with actually magnets in there. But for the-

Mason: (51:31)

There's a little ALI G thing going on there for a second there [crosstalk 00:51:34], actually. Once you moved your hand away, it's no more ALI G. That was like [inaudible 00:51:42].

Dayne Barkley: (51:41)

There's more to my stash.

Mason: (51:48)

Actually, the stash, I was like, really, it trips me out for a second. Man, it's such a good product. I'm happy that they have these clip-ons more than anything because it did feel just doing the minimum with the others, which I think is good, but I think it's going to be... and it's awesome because it is one of those things which if you don't acknowledge the fact that you're smashing your body with synthetic light all day, flickering light all day and then all night, it's one of those things where, as we were saying before, maybe you don't notice it because you're not quite sensitive enough or maybe your body will adapt and just survive. But it is one of those things that beats away your nervous system and your hormones and then your organs. And then it's just going to contribute to that loss of Jing basically, then you get to 50 and 60 or 70 and it's a little harder for your body to hold on.

Mason: (52:48)

Coming back to eye health, can you just explain, as far as you want to go into it or just keeping its surface, in terms of the contribution of you working on screens every day, of having the day clip on, the yellow lens on, just the contribution it's going to give to you maintaining general eye health and anything else, whether it's headaches or anything else that comes from that? And then any other tips that can work around the glasses to ensure that you are staying healthy in this crazy inside world?

Dayne Barkley: (53:19)

Well, it's great because after COVID, there are driven people indoors and so that's given me an ability now to actually reach a new audience as well and be more conscious of that. Myself and Indi as well, predominantly, our work is on a laptop or on a computer, so therefore, if I'm editing a podcast, it's on a computer screen. It's every day and wearing them. The funny thing I find too is that sometimes thoughts come to me in the shower and I'm like, I don't believe there is such a thing as headaches or fatigue or eye strain or digital eye strain. I feel it's a lack of knowledge and integration of tools that can prevent that. The only reason why you have them is because you don't have protection for your eyes. You're either not integrating your software in your screen to sort of dim the lighting on your computer screen.

Dayne Barkley: (54:06)

That whole area for me, I find that it's a very easy thing to integrate that can have such a profound daily impact on my health. So I installed iris.tech. I installed that on all my computers. It's on my Mac here, it's on my laptop as well. And so-

Mason: (54:24)

Is it Iris? I-R-I-S?

Dayne Barkley: (54:25)

Yeah. It's iristech.co, I think it is. It's Daniel who created that. It's an incredible software. It's either you can get a free version or you can get one for $10. That's the blue-blocking software. I had a chat with him, actually, and he was saying he agrees as well is that blue-blocking software for screens and blue blockers, they don't compete. They're actually complementary to each other. I actually put it on and make sure everyone has Iris on the screen and you can change the temperature of the screen. Right now, mine's at a dim incandescent light at 2,300 Kelvin. You can actually change the frequency. If you need to have colour, if you're working with colour, then you can put it to daylight, which is a 6,500 Kelvin. If you want to have it as dull as possible, which is great for the eyes, is to drop it down to whatever's comfortable to your eyes.

Dayne Barkley: (55:16)

We recommend that for everyone, for any screen users to put that on as well as blue blockers. In that case there, I feel like it's almost impossible to get digital eye strain, headaches, fatigue that comes from screens, overexposure of screens because I haven't personally had since that. Having that on the screens and working on the laptop all day, sometimes with the blue blockers on, I find that's such an important... that is also not an excuse just to be because you had a protection now that you can just thrash yourself on a computer.

Dayne Barkley: (55:46)

For me, it still requires elements of breaking in as well. If I go in for an afternoon break to do some rebounding or just to get outside for some fresh air or actually move my laptop outside to work, there's elements of that, of movement breaks and breaks throughout and also just taking your glasses off and being exposed to natural lighting throughout the day is also important where possible. Sometimes if it's a dark, cloudy day, you might not have the option to do that, but at least remove myself from the computer and actually allow my eyes to adjust to normal lighting and daylight that comes into the windows, at least, I find is really important.

Dayne Barkley: (56:21)

It's a tool that some people might take like, "Oh, I've got this now. I can just forget about that element," that's still not great. It's not great getting such an exposure to a screen or unofficial lighting, but it's a protection you can add to that as well as integrating in-breaks periodically throughout the day that make you feel comfortable. With those together, I don't believe it's possible to get headaches, and fatigues, and eyestrain if you're having that kind of protection implemented daily. There's other elements, of course. It's not like it's just this and just that. If you're dehydrated, you're most likely to get that as well.

Dayne Barkley: (56:56)

That will be my recommendation for most people in a modern world who have Iris installed and having blue blockers on, at least with the base lens, if not with the day clip. If you need to have colour, work with colour, then you can turn it on up for a period of time and then turn it back down again. In that way there, I can work consistently on a computer now and not have any problems whatsoever.

Mason: (57:18)

Nice.

Dayne Barkley: (57:18)

It's a more felt experience as well. People might be able to see or hear that and go, "I always get headaches," but unless you do it for a period of time, you wouldn't actually know what it's like.

Mason: (57:28)

Did you find Iris superior to f.lux?

Dayne Barkley: (57:31)

Yeah. I started on f.lux and then Iris was... Daniel, the guy from the... he's in Eastern Europe somewhere and he's a software developer and he created this from that. It also has the ability to lower the flicker rate as well or remove the flicker rate in the computer. If you buy the advanced one, then you can also customise it really intricately as well. So that was one I was really happy with. It's a one-time fee as well, so that was just a no-brainer for me. Having that installed in the computers is just... I can sometimes actually have just that and not wear blue blockers. It's that effective. It's not having both of them together, it's just a combo.

Mason: (58:10)

I'm just checking out, I think, for the lifelong [inaudible 00:58:13]. It's 50 bucks. It's not much. I wonder if they have business packages or something that. Anyway-

Dayne Barkley: (58:22)

Probably would.

Mason: (58:23)

I'll check them out. I think it's good because I've been a little bit not inspired by f.lux. I like to set and forget, but I like the idea of a little bit easier customization. I feel f.lux, it's just extreme. It's changing into what I'm doing. I just never understood it. It's been like, I don't know, however many years I've been using it and I'm just not in song with it. I probably could be if I put a little bit more effort in, but I don't have time. I don't have time. I'm bloody moving and shaking here. So I'm going to check that out. That's awesome.

Mason: (58:54)

The other thing I was going to quickly ask you about is what your take on eye exercises just because I'm not sure if this is any of your area. But my crew have been asking me a lot about lately and I've been talking more to them about rather than doing exercises that potentially create a little bit more strain, if they're feeling strain, to go out and gaze at natural landscape and what I recommend is... is that your take as well?

Dayne Barkley: (59:22)

Yeah.

Mason: (59:23)

[crosstalk 00:59:23].

Dayne Barkley: (59:24)

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I agree with that. I'm not someone that's like, "Oh, look up and down or do these certain techniques." I don't think it's practical for most people to or even just to be able to implement that daily, it'd be very hard to put that in rather than putting on a pair of glasses, then taking breaks, and then going out, and looking at natural landscapes that are from afar or close or just a natural sunlight into the skin and the eyes. Even on a cloudy day, you can still benefit from that. That alone, I think, that breaking period and then going out and just having... it could be five to 10 minutes. That's enough to be able to get just a reset, I guess, of the body because this welded, this digital screen is not what we're used to, but we can find ways to protect ourselves because it is waving its beam, how we can connect as well. I agree with you on that one.

Mason: (01:00:11)

Nice. I'm loving this conversation at the moment because this is the nature of what life is going to be like. It's responsible business ownership and management to educate your people about these because reality is, otherwise, you're allowing, which isn't... I'm not saying this from a morality space. This isn't black and white. But there's essentially a little bit of sacrifice of a core function in order to work in a particular way. We can do better. I'm not saying it's wrong if you're not doing these things or implementing it as a manager or a business owner, but it's worth us considering them. My crew had been asking me about it a lot, so I'm going to start getting... it should be in an OHNS level [crosstalk 01:00:56]. Definitely get them all listening to this and start making this switch over to Barkley because they look sexy.

Dayne Barkley: (01:01:06)

Thank you.

Mason: (01:01:09)

The practicality around the clip is good. It's like choosing your own adventure is always ideal. I haven't chatted to you about it, but is there something we can hook up in terms of giving the SuperFeast as a code that they can use when they go and check in your... do you want to just talk about it again? We'll just reiterate the quality, the price point, what they can expect and then what we can do from a code perspective?

Dayne Barkley: (01:01:33)

Yeah, definitely. That was a really good question. It's contemplating over the years as well is that the price point is probably one of the biggest ones that I had trouble with because of my money stories behind of I wanted to make it affordable for people, but I also wanted the business to still be sustainable and grow. So I'm like, "What can I find that balance?" Not having any idea of business backgrounds, I'm not a business person or a marketer or anything really, I'm just someone who wants to create a product, and get it to people, and have impact. I had to learn all these things along the way.

Dayne Barkley: (01:02:04)

For me, the pricing point, they're 198 Australian. Essentially, you're getting four pairs in one. So you're getting the base lens and the three clip-ons. So you have the interchangeable flavour, so to speak, of four different times from day to night. That there, to get that same amount of effectiveness from another pair or from anything else out there, I've done the research and it'd be close to 500 Australian dollars to get. And you have to own about two or three pairs then, so it's the inconvenience of owning two to three pairs, as well as having the same effectiveness that we'd have from these glasses. For me, it was like, "Great, I can make it affordable for most people," and all they need is one pair and it gives them the ability to be protected from day to night and that's all they really need.

Dayne Barkley: (01:02:48)

The price point was very difficult. I didn't get it in a space that mine are the most expensive to make out of all the blue blockers because of the elements of the clip-ons and they're the most expensive part of the glasses. The profit margin is nowhere near as big as say most of the other blue blockers out there. But for me, I believe that the universe, and life, and God would just give what I need if I'm really out there with a great intention and that's what I needed to do. The business won't grow as fast as say the other companies that are out there because of their huge profit margins. But for me, it's like, it could still work, I could still make it work, and I could still move forward. 198 for a four-in-one pair, essentially, for the glasses.

Dayne Barkley: (01:03:27)

What was your other question? What was it about?

Mason: (01:03:32)

For what you're doing, I've bought a lot of cheapy pairs. It's just like buying something quality, all of a sudden, you feel more aligned in integrating it. I find it a good price point. The other one, are we able to set up a code like maybe just like SuperFeast.

Dayne Barkley: (01:03:48)

Yeah.

Mason: (01:03:50)

What can we give them? We should have talked about this beforehand. Look at us, high-flying businessmen.

Dayne Barkley: (01:03:54)

High-flying businessmen.

Mason: (01:03:55)

[crosstalk 01:03:55].

Dayne Barkley: (01:03:57)

Free glasses anyone. Give them 10% off. Use the code SuperFeast and we'll set it up for you, guys.

Mason: (01:04:05)

Man, so awesome. Website is barkleyeyewear.com.

Dayne Barkley: (01:04:13)

Yep.

Mason: (01:04:13)

That's it?

Dayne Barkley: (01:04:14)

Yeah, and then Instagram, @barkleyeyewear. It's funny because everywhere and every hat as a founder has been working on social media, and then working on website design, and working on business development. It's all these elements right now, it's just myself and Indi really building that out. It's slow and steady, but it's just great connecting with someone like yourself because I think you understand that of anyone out there.

Mason: (01:04:42)

Yeah, man. It's crazy how many parallels they've been to hearing your story. It's good you're putting yourself out there because you need a real... if you go down that integrity path, and you're not doing the quick scaling thing, and you're not compromising on the things that people compromise in order to get that scaling, you need to put a face to the business, and you obviously need to do a lot of education, and you got to be charismatic when talking about it, which you luckily are. Because there's a lot of people who have a lot of integrity as well and who are able to talk about this stuff with a genuine nature, but they're just not quite able to connect with the audience. It makes it a little bit harder. It's awesome that you're truly embracing that enthusiasm because it makes life a lot easier, trust me. You've got a cool podcast as well. Living Holistically with Dayne and Indi, which people can check out you guys.

Dayne Barkley: (01:05:41)

Yeah. The first season is on sleep on that one There are people who want to learn about sleep. It's that whole season and this season. Your episode will be coming out soon for that one too, for nutrition. We're talking about everything to do with that as well. We focus on one area of holistic health and time for that podcast.

Mason: (01:05:57)

I think by the time this one comes out, it'll be out. Guys, you don't even have to wait. [crosstalk 01:06:00].

Dayne Barkley: (01:06:02)

That's it.

Mason: (01:06:04)

Thanks, man. Anything else you wanted to throw in there or places you want to send people?

Dayne Barkley: (01:06:08)

No. I think that's it. The podcast, and then the Instagram, and the website is enough for people to find us, and to learn more, and I guess reaching out as well. We're really reachable. I find that a lot of learning about reaching out to different impetuses or businesses out there, you never get responses sometimes. Sometimes it's just really hard to get into people's, I don't know, DMs or whatever that looks like. For us though, we're really open to receive messages, and want people to reach out to us, and ask us stuff.

Mason: (01:06:39)

Great. I like that attitude. We're also going to buy a pair and do a giveaway. If you're listening to this podcast and it's just come out, jump over to SuperFeast's Instagram, get yourself in on that. And then if you don't win, go and buy yourself a pair and use the code SuperFeast and get 10% off. Man, thanks heaps. Big love to Indi and yourself and chat real soon.

Dayne Barkley: (01:07:09)

We will. Thanks, Mason. Thanks for having me on.

Mason: (01:07:12)

All good, man. Ciao.

Dayne Barkley: (01:07:13)

Take care.